Whole leads: Which would you like to hear?

[WYBIMLA]

I know it's been said that RC is "all done", but as a fan I can dream can't I?

I'm aware this topic may not be welcome and maybe it's been exhausted, however I want to try and see if I can get any more information on these songs I listed if possible.

It's really early to mention the 50th anniversary compilation, but I'm wishing and hoping for that bonus track. Am I nuts? Unless everything was lost in that fire, but I think there's got to be something floating around somewhere. I've read that Richard is "over it" and he's not part of the business anymore for a number of reasons, BUT if there were any songs that were completed for "As time goes by", but didn't make the cut I hope they surface.

Based on the buried treasures list there was still some unreleased songs that have a whole lead according to an interview with Richard. There's some he said "sucked" and wouldn't put out, but other titles he said he would consider.

So, I picked at that list and I guess this is what we're left with that would actually be releasable.

1) All my life (Rich said he wanted to put it out)
2) Slaughter on tenth avenue (instrumental)
3) Try and win a friend
4) A wedding prayer- RC
5) Won't you play a simple melody
6) You'll never know- RC vocal
7) The moon's a harsh mistress
8) And when he smiles
9) All it is now (was said to be too Carpenter-esque, but has a whole lead)
10) Why don't they understand
11) Something's missing (it was rumoured that Richard wanted to work on this KC outtake)
12) Love makin' love to you (I included it here just because it was a finished song)

What do you think? Which ones would you really want to hear or see officially released?

 

[Rick-An Ordinary Fool]

Easy Peasy.....I'm easy...I'd be HaPpY with either or

Something's Missing
Love Makin' Love To You

 

[masqueraded]

Just give us As Time Goes By Part 2, please.

 

[newvillefan]

These would be my pick, but I've almost given up any hope we'll ever get any new material from Richard now that he's retired.

1) All my life (Rich said he wanted to put it out) - I'd LOVE to hear this!
3) Try and win a friend - curious as to what this would sound like.
6) You'll never know- RC vocal - Richard's best lead vocal on a recording ever. It puzzles me why he didn't include this on ATGB.
7) The moon's a harsh mistress - see below.
9) All it is now (was said to be too Carpenter-esque, but has a whole lead) - never heard of this until now?!
10) Why don't they understand - would love to hear this too!
11) Something's missing (it was rumoured that Richard wanted to work on this KC outtake) - nice track but rubbish ending.
12) Love makin' love to you (I included it here just because it was a finished song) - second to 'If I Had You', the best thing to come out of the solo sessions.

I just looked up 'The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress' and found a version by Glen Campbell - this song was made for Karen!! I hear her singing it when I watch this video.

 

[Someday]

Try Linda Ronstadt's version (1982). It's superb.

 

[Rick-An Ordinary Fool]

When I heard Rumer's version of "The Moon's A Harsh Mistress" I could immediately hear Karen singing this live in a concert setting. I heard Glen's version first while I was waiting for Rumer's single to arrive and when I heard Rumer's I liked her version better.

 

[Chris Mills]

Going for the negative take on this post........the best we can dream of for the 50th Carpenters anniversary, is a compilation from the Japanese...........but it's better than nothing! (I can do positive)

 

[WYBIMLA]

Ooops I made a mistake here. I think Richard was referring to "Something's missing" and said "All it is now is a track and a work lead, but it's really Carpenter-esque". I think I had read the sentence wrong. haha So, "All it is now" isn't a song. Sorry about that.

Here's a video of Why don't they understand by George hamilton iv. However, Carpenters liked the song and even though Karen sang it better they both preferred the original version. If that's Karen's wishes then Rich probably wouldn't have wanted to put it out. Trouble with a lot of these is that according to Richard some of these songs on the buried treasures list just weren't for them as well.


Here's Try to win a friend. It's not that exciting of a song, imo.


I'm not sure how badly I'd want to hear "Won't you play a simple melody" or some of the instrumentals.

So, for my new list then I would have to whittle it down to:

1) All my life
2) Try and win a friend
3) The moon's a harsh mistress
4) You'll never know
5) And when he smiles
6) Something's missing
7) Love makin' love to you

We already know what the last four sound like.
Actually, wasn't "And when he smiles" released in some form already? So, I guess there's only three songs left that would actually be interesting to hear. "All my life", "The moon's a harsh mistress", and "Try and win a friend". I'd also like a better quality version of "You'll never know" cause it was a fantastic Richard vocal.

Hmm over all I think our collections are pretty complete folks, but still I'd love to hear those three. I'm curious about "All my life".

 

[byline]

Actually, wasn't "And when he smiles" released in some form already?

It's a bonus track on the As Time Goes By CD, and it's certainly is one of my favorite highlights from their 1971 Live at the BBC special:

 

[newvillefan]

Actually, wasn't "And when he smiles" released in some form already?

It was released on ATGB...and the album version didn't have a lead vocal on it because Karen was playing drums on the track.

I've looked up Linda Ronstadt's version of 'The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress' and I can't for the life of me understand why this hasn't been released, unless there's a problem with the vocal track. It's so made for Karen. 'Try To Win A Friend' (the Streisand version above) is a bit of a sleeper track and nothing special, but I can hear Karen singing it and hey, I'm not going to turn anything down if it features a new KC lead! 'Won't You Play A Simple Melody' features Agnes and Harold Carpenter singing, so while it would be a nice curiosity, it's not something I'd be that bothered about being released.

 

[byline]

I've looked up Linda Ronstadt's version of 'The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress' and I can't for the life of me understand why this hasn't been released, unless there's a problem with the vocal track. It's so made for Karen.

Long ago I had Linda's Get Closer album. I would have bought it when it first came out. I'll bet I wore the grooves right off that particular track on the LP, I listened to it so much. Hers was such a haunting rendition. I seem to remember Richard saying he felt their version didn't bring anything new to the table. But the same criticism might have been made about "Desperado" ... yet I'm still happy that song was included on Horizon. To my ears, there's nothing strikingly new or groundbreaking about Karen's reading of the song, yet it's so intimate, and as you say, so made for Karen's voice, that I love hearing her sing it.

 

[WYBIMLA]

Would Richard be offended if fans were to write to him about these songs?
"Try to win a friend", "The moon's a harsh mistress", "All my life" and "You'll never know".
At this point he's probably not wild about Karen's outtakes at all.
But, a letter may include "Something's missing" and "Love makin' love to you".
Those three full leads of Karen I would love to hear of course.
I'd just like to know if they're still around at least.

 

[newvillefan]

Would Richard be offended if fans were to write to him about these songs?
"Try to win a friend", "The moon's a harsh mistress", "All my life" and "You'll never know".

I do know he's not happy that his version of 'You'll Never Know' was leaked onto the internet. He didn't even know it was in the public domain until it was put to him in an interview.

 

[ullalume]

Would Richard be offended if fans were to write to him about these songs?
"Try to win a friend", "The moon's a harsh mistress", "All my life" and "You'll never know".
At this point he's probably not wild about Karen's outtakes at all.
But, a letter may include "Something's missing" and "Love makin' love to you".
Those three full leads of Karen I would love to hear of course.
I'd just like to know if they're still around at least.

Hey there,

I think Richard's been getting letters about those tracks since the list "went public" back in 1992. If I were you, I'd give the letter idea a bit of a wide birth.

If anything came out now, then I'm guessing it would be 1 or 2 bonus tracks on the inevitable Japanese 50/50 compilation in '19, though I seriously doubt even that will happen.

Welcome to the group WYBIMLA

 

[WYBIMLA]

I'm not sure what the problem is with releasing a leaked track. Maybe that's just me.
But, those three songs I mentioned would be amazing as bonus tracks. Those haven't been leaked. So, maybe they're fit for release someday.
Or perhaps the 50th anniversary will be similar to the 40th. Just another compilation we've heard before.

I just bring all this up because I know there's still people out there that I've seen in youtube comments or Facebook groups that are aching for anything else left. Fans would just love to hear the two or three songs we think exist or an official release of some of those leaked outtakes.
Then, again we're four years before the 50th project begins. So, what do I know. Lol

I'm sure Richard knows of all this, but I'm not so sure why he didn't say very much about it. I respect that he's retired, but "all done" wasn't a satisfying answer.

Anyways, thanks for the welcome!

 

[byline]

I will add my welcome to the group, WYBIMLA! You're not alone in your frustration with Richard's "all done" answer. However, I think that looking at it from Richard's point of view, he believes he has put everything out there that he feels is worth putting out there. His standard for what he considers worthwhile may well be different from ours. I look at the body of releases and re-releases that have come to us since Karen's death as a gift. For me, the glass is half-full. Richard has devoted a tremendous amount of time, energy and care – probably more than most of us realize – into getting these recordings out there. I'm guessing that this has been an emotional process for him, one he feels he has completed to his own satisfaction. So for Richard, he really does feel all done. The work feels as complete as it can be, without Karen here to contribute to it. I also realize that as long as it's believed there are tracks "hidden away" (real or imagined), people will yearn to hear those tracks because they give us more of Karen's voice. So they are conflicting viewpoints – Richard on the inside, the rest of us on the outside, some wondering and waiting – that probably will never be reconciled.

 

[Jamesj75]

When I heard Rumer's version of "The Moon's A Harsh Mistress" I could immediately hear Karen singing this live in a concert setting. I heard Glen's version first while I was waiting for Rumer's single to arrive and when I heard Rumer's I liked her version better.

Chris (and all): I am a big Rumer fan, too, as I've stated. And I'd highly recommend Josh Groban's version (All That Echoes, 2013). I've seen Josh in concert a couple of times, and in 2014 he performed this great song. It would be incredible to hear Karen's version...

 

[newvillefan]

I seem to remember Richard saying he felt their version didn't bring anything new to the table.

I'm guessing that Richard's summary of their version as not bringing anything new to the table would be completely different to the fans' point of view if he released it. I'd bet my bottom dollar it's amazing and more's the pity he's now given up on doing any more work on unreleased tracks.

 

[mr J.]

I know it's been said that RC is "all done", but as a fan I can dream can't I?

I'm aware this topic may not be welcome and maybe it's been exhausted, however I want to try and see if I can get any more information on these songs I listed if possible.

It's really early to mention the 50th anniversary compilation, but I'm wishing and hoping for that bonus track. Am I nuts? Unless everything was lost in that fire, but I think there's got to be something floating around somewhere. I've read that Richard is "over it" and he's not part of the business anymore for a number of reasons, BUT if there were any songs that were completed for "As time goes by", but didn't make the cut I hope they surface.

Based on the buried treasures list there was still some unreleased songs that have a whole lead according to an interview with Richard. There's some he said "sucked" and wouldn't put out, but other titles he said he would consider.

So, I picked at that list and I guess this is what we're left with that would actually be releasable.

1) All my life (Rich said he wanted to put it out)
2) Slaughter on tenth avenue (instrumental)
3) Try and win a friend
4) A wedding prayer- RC
5) Won't you play a simple melody
6) You'll never know- RC vocal
7) The moon's a harsh mistress
8) And when he smiles
9) All it is now (was said to be too Carpenter-esque, but has a whole lead)
10) Why don't they understand
11) Something's missing (it was rumoured that Richard wanted to work on this KC outtake)
12) Love makin' love to you (I included it here just because it was a finished song)

What do you think? Which ones would you really want to hear or see officially released?

Welcome to the forum!

This topic has been frequently discussed here.A few brief comments about this:

1.There's several more finished tracks in the vaults-in addition to what you mentioned(three tan album outtakes & three from the 1982 session-among others).

2.Richard categorizes these outtakes into two different sections:

1. Songs that we never should've recorded-don't work for our sound.
2.Songs that other 70's era pop artists recorded & made well-known.

3. None of the outtakes were lost in the Universal fire-they are in Richard's personal storage facility in Pennsylvania.

4.Richard considered some of those outtakes for release-but subsequently changed his mind.Richard evidently completed some of those while working on "As Time Goes By" in 1999.Whatever tracks weren't included on ATGB were resigned to the vault permanently.

5.I'm not sure if there will be a 50th anniversary compilation set-but if there is,nothing new will be on it.

 

[Mark-T]

mr j- Have you talked to Richard about a 50th set? Is that how you know there would be nothing new if there is such a set? My hunch has always been you have some connections we know nothing about.

 

[Harry]

I think it's a bit early to be thinking about a 50th anniversary, since we're only at 46 as of next month. There's another good three years or more before anyone needs to think about such a thing. Remember too that it's not Richard who originates this stuff - it's Universal. Certainly THEY are not thinking about such things at this point. If and when they do, they'll contact Richard and either things will work out or they won't. Maybe it WILL originate in Japan. Maybe they'll get another big box set. Maybe here we'll get a compilation like with the 40th. But it all starts with Universal. They're the gatekeepers in this scenario.

Harry

 

[WYBIMLA]

I know for sure it's early for talking about all of this. We won't know until it happens... or doesn't happen. It would be up to universal. I don't see why they wouldn't do something for the occasion.

The thought of any "new" release is just an exciting thought for a Carpenters fan even though we have all the songs already. Lol Maybe as a fan I have enthusiasm, creativity and ideas for the legacy. Of course fans demands or fantasies probably won't come true at this point.

The 50th will most likely be the next release. I think it's important because I don't think there will be another time really to prompt for any bonus material. That'll be the moment. Unless Richard would put out that rumoured Xmas album, but that's... anyway... Also, next year will mark 20 years since the release of KC's solo work if that means anything probably not. A re-release with some of the outtakes...in my dreams maybe.

I don't know why it's hard to accept that this is it. We got what we got. I'm sorry for dragging this conversation on.
I think it's because fans have had hints of things to come and then it wasn't delivered. That's why there's still this yearning for any extra recordings, and Richard has surprised fans before when he's had a change of heart.
Also, because Karen just so happened to have one the most beautiful voices in all recording history. Of course we want more.

It's an interesting situation with Richard's relationship to the fans. I'm sure it has been very difficult over the years to do what he's done without his business partner, friend, and sister. We're lucky to have remixes, VOTH, Lovelines, As time goes by, etc.

 

[Charlie D]

Does anyone have or know where I can find the full list of unreleased songs and the years they were recorded?

 

[BarryT60]

I know it's been said that RC is "all done", but as a fan I can dream can't I?

I'm aware this topic may not be welcome and maybe it's been exhausted, however I want to try and see if I can get any more information on these songs I listed if possible.

It's really early to mention the 50th anniversary compilation, but I'm wishing and hoping for that bonus track. Am I nuts? Unless everything was lost in that fire, but I think there's got to be something floating around somewhere. I've read that Richard is "over it" and he's not part of the business anymore for a number of reasons, BUT if there were any songs that were completed for "As time goes by", but didn't make the cut I hope they surface.

Based on the buried treasures list there was still some unreleased songs that have a whole lead according to an interview with Richard. There's some he said "sucked" and wouldn't put out, but other titles he said he would consider.

So, I picked at that list and I guess this is what we're left with that would actually be releasable.

1) All my life (Rich said he wanted to put it out)
2) Slaughter on tenth avenue (instrumental)
3) Try and win a friend
4) A wedding prayer- RC
5) Won't you play a simple melody
6) You'll never know- RC vocal
7) The moon's a harsh mistress
8) And when he smiles
9) All it is now (was said to be too Carpenter-esque, but has a whole lead)
10) Why don't they understand
11) Something's missing (it was rumoured that Richard wanted to work on this KC outtake)
12) Love makin' love to you (I included it here just because it was a finished song)

What do you think? Which ones would you really want to hear or see officially released?

All My Life and The Moon is a harsh Mistress. if I had to go with one - then Moon. However, I like both tunes.

I don't know all it is now... but if it is too Carpenter-seque, then bring it on! Is "Won;t Yo Play a Simple melody" Sonebody Done Somebody Wrong Song? If so - I'd pass.... in favor of the two aforementioned tunes.

I personally do not like the draggy Try To Win a Friend. It is a draggy subject matter and a snoozer of a melody imho.... I always hit skip on Barbra's version....