Ticket to Ride, Passage, Made in America gold status yet?

adam

Well-Known Member
Hi
Not sure if this has been discussed before but after all these years Ticket to ride,Passage,Made in america .Have these albums achieved Gold status yet?
 
Those three albums haven't been certified gold-and probably never will.All three have been out-of-print in the US for several years.(There's a few import copies of Passage & MIA floating around on Amazon).

Total cumulative sales are : Ticket To Ride- Approximately 400,000
Passage -Approximately 450,000
Made In America- Approximately 500,000
 
Those three albums haven't been certified gold-and probably never will.

Total cumulative sales are : Ticket To Ride- Approximately 400,000
Passage -Approximately 450,000
Made In America- Approximately 500,000

And people complain that Karen's solo album hasn't sold all that well, when these efforts were released to the masses two decades or more earlier!
 
Your statement doesn't make sense-can you elaborate?

Sure :). What I mean is that the solo album was shelved as the label didn't believe it would be a success, but albums like Passage and Made In America were deemed fit for release and have been out there for far longer, yet haven't really achieved that much more in terms of sales (relatively speaking) than the solo album.

I don't mean for this thread to be another 'KC solo LP' discussion. It just struck me reading the above sales figures that if what I'm led to believe is true, Karen's album has sold in the region of a couple of hundred thousand copies in less than half the time that these albums have been in the public domain. That's not bad going for an album deemed unworthy of release, compared to the performance of Carpenters albums that were released around the same time as it was recorded.
 
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Sure :). What I mean is that the solo album was shelved as the label didn't believe it would be a success, but albums like Passage and Made In America were deemed fit for release and have been out there for far longer, yet haven't really achieved that much more in terms of sales (relatively speaking) than the solo album.

I don't mean for this thread to be another 'KC solo LP' discussion. It just struck me reading the above sales figures that if what I'm led to believe is true, Karen's album has sold in the region of a couple of hundred thousand copies in less than half the time that these albums have been in the public domain. That's not bad going for an album deemed unworthy of release, compared to the performance of Carpenters albums that were released around the same time as it was recorded.
We don't want to turn this into a discussion on Karen's solo album,but Karen's album sold less than 100,000 in the US and went out-of-print less than ten years after its release.

Ticket,Passage and MIA weren't huge sellers upon their release-but they were consistent sellers and racked up a decent amount of cumulative sales.Those three albums stayed in-print for decades.
 
We don't want to turn this into a discussion on Karen's solo album,but Karen's album sold less than 100,000 in the US and went out-of-print less than ten years after its release.
I appreciate the reference to U.S. sales, but that still doesn't nail it down. We all know that the Carpenters' worldwide audience was different animal than their U.S. audience, and it was international sales that bolstered their albums, some of which didn't do so well in the U.S. So it's reasonable to assume that Karen's solo album potentially sold very well in the international market. But that's the problem. We're going by assumptions, and it would be really, really nice if this could be verified objectively.
 
It's true that Karen's solo album and many Carpenters original albums are 'out of print'....meaning you can no longer buy the hard copy CDs in stores. Be that as it may, ALL of their albums (solo K.C. included) are there to behold on I-Tunes and other sites. That means they're still selling. Would be wonderful to get updated info.
 
I appreciate the reference to U.S. sales, but that still doesn't nail it down. We all know that the Carpenters' worldwide audience was different animal than their U.S. audience, and it was international sales that bolstered their albums, some of which didn't do so well in the U.S. So it's reasonable to assume that Karen's solo album potentially sold very well in the international market. But that's the problem. We're going by assumptions, and it would be really, really nice if this could be verified objectively.
The discussion on this thread is about US sales.We don't generally talk about international sales because there is no way to accurately verify sales from every international market-and it would be a daunting task to even try.

Every Carpenters albums did well in the US-and what was happening with International sales had absolutely no effect on K&R's US market.
 
But the overall success of an album IS affected by international sales. That's why it would be interesting to know. I'm sure there's a way. We just need to figure out how to do it. :)
 
As we all know, "Offering" had initial sales of 18,000 copies (Coleman) and was
later re-packaged as "Ticket To Ride", wherein sales reached roughly 230,000 copies.
(I have to dig up the reference for that last sales figure, an interview, I believe.)
Unfortunately, I am unable to locate any current sales figures pertaining to the trilogy .
Given the initial impetus to 'dump' Carpenters from A&M's artist roster, after the dismal sales of that first album,
obviously the view that "every Carpenters' album did well in the USA" is a slight exaggeration.
Seems as if Richard Carpenter would be overjoyed if he ever attains a Gold Record Award for his first conceived musical album.
(And, if that album was "inconsequential", why go to the expense of reissuing the material, anyway?)
Too many other issues (besides the music) go into this mystery of sales figures:
the promotional interviews Richard Carpenter did for "Voice of The Heart" (even then, its sales only did moderately well)
the overall sales increase after the airing of the CBS Movie (which did not help sales of Richard Carpenter's "Time")
an increase in sales due to the Tribute Album which, accounted for subsequent release of Karen's solo album (Schmidt, The Reader).
Always, more questions than answers.


 
As we all know, "Offering" had initial sales of 18,000 copies (Coleman) and was
later re-packaged as "Ticket To Ride", wherein sales reached roughly 230,000 copies.
(I have to dig up the reference for that last sales figure, an interview, I believe.)
Unfortunately, I am unable to locate any current sales figures pertaining to the trilogy .
Given the initial impetus to 'dump' Carpenters from A&M's artist roster, after the dismal sales of that first album,
obviously the view that "every Carpenters' album did well in the USA" is a slight exaggeration.
Seems as if Richard Carpenter would be overjoyed if he ever attains a Gold Record Award for his first conceived musical album.
(And, if that album was "inconsequential", why go to the expense of reissuing the material, anyway?)
Too many other issues (besides the music) go into this mystery of sales figures:
the promotional interviews Richard Carpenter did for "Voice of The Heart" (even then, its sales only did moderately well)
the overall sales increase after the airing of the CBS Movie (which did not help sales of Richard Carpenter's "Time")
an increase in sales due to the Tribute Album which, accounted for subsequent release of Karen's solo album (Schmidt, The Reader).
Always, more questions than answers.
GARY-you tend to get a little melodramatic with your posts,and it would help if you paid more attention to the factual information being offered.Many of your questions would be answered by simply L I S T E N I N G.

Offering did sell about 18,000 copies the year of it's release-but the repackaged Ticket To Ride sold about 250,000 copies by 1975.By the early 1990's,cumulative sales had reached 400,000+.

"Ticket" is K&R's worst-selling album,but it still managed to do well cumulatively.400,000 copies is a decent selling album-and most of Herb Alpert's,Rita Coolidge & Sergio Mendes'(among other veteran A&M artists) albums didn't even sell that well.

And,forget about searching online for answers to your questions-you can simply write to Richard,the source,for a definitive answer to any of your questions.(Carpenter Family Foundation in Thousand Oaks,CA).
 
But the overall success of an album IS affected by international sales. That's why it would be interesting to know. I'm sure there's a way. We just need to figure out how to do it. :)
Where did you get the idea that the overall success of an album is affected by International sales? If a US album sells well in the US,then it is a successful album-regardless of how well it sold Internationally.K&R were American recording artists,and we live in the US-what's going on with International record sales is just an afterthought.
 
Gary, you keep on keepin' on!!! These personal critique of posts, wording, spelling, invalidating, psycho-analyzing, smart aleck, insensitive, cocky, repressive behaviors make for discomfort, discord and division. We already have moderators, staff members, teachers , doctors, parents to guide and direct us in proper etiquette, grammar and general well-being. What part of...how many statements...deleted posts is not recognizable to these seemingly blind offenders?
Regarding my personal affronts? MY conscience demands simple childhood learned apology skills and as has been the case past....asked a moderator to remove, delete my perceived transgressions and lack of finesse in communicating. As tho glaucoma abounds, the literary content and subscription to smartass tone and inferences spews from the blind. Herein, I shine a light for the blind to see! Jesus style!!! How much subtlety now resulting in commandment do said followers of forum faux paus require?

This is The CarpenterS A SONG FOR YOU FORUM...correct persons of interest? Here we discuss, disagree, support things either Richard or Karen, Karen and Richard or CarpenterS a 3x Grammy winning duo. PERIOD!!! PERIOD!!! I really detest beleaguering this issue. Absolutely not my thirst for signing on here.

In closing...GET OFF OUR SKIRTS! I move that from here going forward those who misuse this forum and/or site for stated grievances be suspended as warning and subsequently expelled
at future abuse. You never know what or where this place will hurt, dismay or publicly humiliate the most casual of members.First and foremost, I bid anytime I overstep boundaries to be subjected to terms proposed.

'nough said?????????????!!!!!!!!!
Jeff, who is totally miffed!
 
Mr. J, you've crossed the line, now your just downright rude and offensive. So L I S T E N to this Mr. J. Keep it to the facts and not personal attacks on Gary or anyone. If I expressed what I think of some of your posts, Mr. J, I would surely be banned from here.
 
Where did you get the idea that the overall success of an album is affected by International sales? If a US album sells well in the US,then it is a successful album-regardless of how well it sold Internationally.K&R were American recording artists,and we live in the US-what's going on with International record sales is just an afterthought.
You may believe that international sales are an "afterthought" Mr. J., but there were at least two people who didn't share your opinion... Richard and Karen Carpenter! If they weren't concerned with international sales, then why did they tour and do promotions in Japan, the UK, continental Europe, Canada, Australia, Brazil...? International sales meant money in their pockets, and after all, they were in the music "business". Oh, and I doubt that R&K ever considered their foreign fans an afterthought either.

BTW Mr. J., "we" don't all "live in the US". There are many international members on this forum, and we ARE interested in how well they did in our territories. Every member of this forum is entitled to express their interests and opinions, and shouldn't be belittled for it. You may want to tone down the arrogance (ignorance) a little.
 
The discussion on this thread is about US sales.We don't generally talk about international sales because there is no way to accurately verify sales from every international market-and it would be a daunting task to even try.

Every Carpenters albums did well in the US-and what was happening with International sales had absolutely no effect on K&R's US market.

I agree with mstaft - I am not trying to be argumentative, but my understanding is this is an international website and we have members from all over the world and nowhere in the original post was the statement made we are talking about American sales only. Upon some quick research, I found, as many already know, that Nielsen SoundScan is the body charged with tracking record sales. The following is a section about how the sales data is tracked:

"Sales data from cash registers is collected from 14,000 retail, mass merchant, and non-traditional (on-line stores, venues, digital music services, etc.) outlets in the United States, Canada, UK, and Japan.

The requirements for reporting sales to Nielsen SoundScan are that the store has Internet access and a point of sale (POS) inventory system. Submission of sales data to Nielsen SoundScan must be in the form of a text file consisting of all the UPCs sold and the quantities per UPC on a weekly basis. Sales collected from Monday-Sunday or Sunday-Saturday are reported to SoundScan every Monday and made available to SoundScan subscribers every Wednesday.

Nielsen SoundScan clients include these:
  • All major and many independent labels.
  • Distribution companies.
  • Artist managers and booking agents.
  • Concert promoters and venue owners.
  • Online retailers and "digital delivery" companies.
Anyone selling a music product with its own UPC or IRSC may register that product to be tracked by Nielsen SoundScan."

Some additional information from CarpenterS themselves is found in the 'Singles 1969-1981' CD booklet on page 5, Paragraph 3:

"Thirty years after their debut, The Carpenters rank among the most popular acts in recording history. Their Worldwide sales top 100 million copies. Their many honors include three Grammy Awards, an American Music award, a star on the Hollywood Walk of Fame, a recording in the Grammy Hall of Fame, and enough gold and platinum records to fill a museum."

This I think this proves that they (K & R) felt that the international market was a large part of their success; as would many of their international fans.

On a more personal note, I am still surprised that 'Passage' never charted higher.
 
Also, please keep in mind, Mr. J., that Carpenters were the #1 selling INTERNATIONAL artists in 1996, thanks to the Japanese release, '22 Hits Of The Carpenters'. I seem to recall Richard being ecstatic when being presented with that award.
 
"The hearing that is only in the ears is one thing.
The hearing of the understanding is another.
But the hearing of the spirit is not limited to any one faculty, to the ear, or to the mind.
Hence it demands the emptiness of all the faculties. And when the faculties are empty, then the whole being listens.
There is then a direct grasp of what is right there before you that can never be heard with the ear or understood with the mind."
Chinese philosopher Chuang Tzu

Well, in one respect, at least, I have listened.....my personal letter is on its way to Richard Carpenter in a quest for said answer.
But, I do hope that my pestering letter to him will not serve to alienate him from answering other inquiries.
I know he is a gracious man, but his time is probably better spent with his family!

Of course, in no way do I believe that all of my queries will likely ever be answered.
Questions arise anew, everyday, and a quest for answers is never a futile endeavor.
Rather an exciting detective story !
Sans internet, scores of documentation and archival material have crossed my desk, and yet,
questions still linger regarding Carpenters and their career.
Were that quest to end, I would have little need to avail myself of this wonderful resource: A&MCorner!


In conclusion, if I have been,
"melo·dra·mat·ic
- emotional in a way that is very extreme or exaggerated, extremely dramatic or emotional--"

hurrah!
As long as my information serves to instruct, not destruct , I am pleased.
As long as I can proffer an alternative perspective, as truthfully as I can document,
then I make no apologies.
If an emotional element winds it way through my discourse, well, what can I say,
I do love Carpenters!
And, love is often melodramatic.
 
Where did you get the idea that the overall success of an album is affected by International sales? If a US album sells well in the US,then it is a successful album-regardless of how well it sold Internationally.K&R were American recording artists,and we live in the US-what's going on with International record sales is just an afterthought.

With all due respect, I think that's a ridiculous statement. Going by this logic, an album's success is due only to US sales but worldwide sales are worth nothing. I don't even want to elaborate on how disrespectful that is to international fans that have dug deep into their pockets to make albums like 'Horizon', '22 Hits', 'Singles 1969-1973' and 'Their Greatest Hits (1990)' smash albums in countries like England and Japan.
 
Tempted as I may be to go the negative route here (and I don't criticize those who have), let me go the positive route simply by saying:

GaryAlan: You rock! Keep up the great contributions and the great work!! You are inspiring!!
 
Attention everyone in this thread/forum: There appears to be some friction between certain members, and of course we have rules against any personal attacks. There is an "ignore" function on this forum. Basically you highlight a member's name/avatar and add them to your "ignore list". At that point you won't see posts by that member, but you'll see that a post has been made - and you can unhide individual messages if you choose to.

Unfortunately, as moderator, I don't have that privilege. I have to read all of everything that everyone posts. It's a tough job, but someone's got to do it.

So my suggestion is that if anyone is a personal irritant to you, raises your blood-pressure, etc., that you take advantage of the "ignore" function. I use it on other forums and it works well.

That is all.

You may resume your conversations.


Harry
 
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