Nationwide, October 1981 - Full Clip

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newvillefan

I Know My First Name Is Stephen
Hi all

A Carpenters friend Paul Ashurst has kindly posted the full clip of the Carpenters on UK show 'Nationwide' which was pre-recorded and broadcast in October, 1981. This is the clip where presenter Sue Lawley famously challenged Karen about her weight and uttered the words 'anorexia nervosa'.

Sue Lawley gives them a rough ride from the outset and the whole thing falls apart around the 3 minute mark, when they have to start over.

 
Wow! What a find. And presumably this was heavily edited for broadcast, so fascinating to see the whole, slightly uncomfortable, encounter.

I did feel a bit for Karen and Richard as Sue Lawley definitely takes no prisoners in her questioning at the start (although she was known as a fairly no-nonsense journalist so wouldn't have been the type of interviewer to offer superficial questions) and they don't look prepared to deal with the topics raised. What is particularly interesting is whether her line of questioning was just based on lucky guesses or whether she'd had access to some insider information - using the term 'anorexia' straight out is very to the point at a time when people weren't using the term commonly and emphasising the possibility of a 'rift' between them could well have been hinting at Karen's solo album, which wasn't really common knowledge at the time and was something they surely would not have been keen to discuss. It just seems a bit too close to what we now know was going on behind the scenes to be pure coincidence.

The interview does make you feel so sad for Karen though - looking very drawn and having to talk not just about her physical problems but also about a marriage that was in the process of falling apart.
 
It just seems a bit too close to what we now know was going on behind the scenes to be pure coincidence.


Believe me, she will have done her homework, this was no coincidence. I was cringing throughout, I really did feel for them especially the bit off camera where Richard seems to want to call a halt to the whole thing, effectively complaining that they hadn't come all the way to the UK to be grilled about Karen's health. What's most ironic of all is that Karen flat-out denies being 84lbs in 1975, when that's right around the weight she was while sat on the sofa in this very interview.

Someone on another forum said "shame is a big part of every addiction and there's no way that broadcasting this could have been helpful to her". What I'm not 100% sure about is which portions of this went out in the finished, edited-down broadcast, but I'm sure the part about her weight was included because it's become known generally as the first time anyone had dared to publicly challenge Karen about her health using the term 'anorexia nervosa'.
 
I'm not sure whether the part where anorexia was mentioned would have been in the original broadcast. I first saw that clip of Sue Lawley putting the question to Karen in the BBC 'Only Yesterday' documentary, which I think was broadcast in 2007. Given that the BBC made this documentary, they'd have had access to the original unedited recording that you posted. Randy Schmidt comments on it in his book, but he also mentions the off-screen comments that Richard made about shutting down the interview, so he must have seen the unedited footage as well rather than just the broadcast version.

So, it's not impossible, but I doubt it was in the original broadcast. If it was, it would be strange that no one referred to it after Karen's passing, as it is quite a startling encounter in terms of seeing Karen confronted directly.

I agree to an extent with the idea that confronting both of them on TV with subjects that would be uncomfortable for them may not have been constructive, but it does make you realise what a gloss they were both still attempting to put on their lives in the face of someone who appears to have had some knowledge about their back story. There was quite a lot for them to be covering up at this time, which is very sad in itself.
 
Wow, not sure what to think of this....I'm on both sides, part of me says it wasn't fair to attack Karen & Richard with Karen's issues when this was really not the format. I feel for them being put in a very ackward position. The term wasn't used much back then for the general public but you can bet "they" knew at that point what it was all about. This was such a personal issue....yet I also believe this was the perfect time for Karen to use this as a platform to first overcome this illness then most importantly help others along the way, much like Princess Diana did in her interviews and news conferences about her illnesses. As a Carpenters fan, it's hard to watch.
 
This video brings up so many feelings....good and bad, obviously. It's sad they were unable or unwilling to delve further into the issues at hand at the time. But overall, I think they did a good job remaining upbeat during the interview, as the issues being brought up were painful ones to both Carpenters. Karen certainly didn't owe Sue Lawley or anyone else an explanation for her appearance, but maybe being confronted so directly was a good thing for her, too.

It's too bad we can't go back in time to this very day, and re-direct Karen to the proper treatment she so desperately needed.
 
Wow, not sure what to think of this....I'm on both sides, part of me says it wasn't fair to attack Karen & Richard with Karen's issues when this was really not the format. I feel for them being put in a very ackward position. The term wasn't used much back then for the general public but you can bet "they" knew at that point what it was all about. This was such a personal issue....yet I also believe this was the perfect time for Karen to use this as a platform to first overcome this illness then most importantly help others along the way, much like Princess Diana did in her interviews and news conferences about her illnesses. As a Carpenters fan, it's hard to watch.
It was obvious she wasn't healthy or ready to talk about it- yet. But I bet she would have gone public eventually as she seemed to care for others.
 
I agree Mark. I wonder what convinced Richard to continue on because obviously if Karen was that upset after the 1st take she would have said to Richard that's it there is no 2nd take. It's almost like the attention went to her she continued to smile and joke around and got through it so did it bother her that much?
 
Nationwide was a BBC prime time family show that was aired each evening at 6pm, Mon-Fri, and I suspect Richard & Karen were really caught off guard by Sue Lawley's personal questions, expecting nothing more than to promote the album MIA.

Karen handled it extremely well, most people might have crumpled during such an attempt to find out the truth, especially in front of cameras in a studio full of strangers. It would have been great if Karen had acknowledged the fact that she was suffering from anorexia, and Sue Lawley knew exactly what she wanted from this interview, but Karen just coolly stuck with the façade, really sad. There really was no helping Karen, she was completely in denial.

As for Karen's appearance, she looks thin, but the bad perm never suited Karen, and she had next to no make-up on her face, but what a smile.

Great clip by the way, have wanted to see this for years.
 
I wonder how Sue Lawley feels about this interview now? Perhaps like Bette Middler, who later apologized for the meanness toward Karen and Richard.
 
It's interesting that Karen got the year of meeting Tom incorrect by a whole year - she states she met him in 1979 and they were married "four months later", when in fact in was April of 1980 that she met him. She'd been married only one year by the time of this interview and I'm sure every bride has the date of their wedding day etched in their minds. She would have known full well that in 1979 she was in New York recording with Phil Ramone, so I feel this was a way of diverting attention away from the 'rift' that Sue Lawley started going on about. Talk about an ambush. I'm sure they didn't realise what they were getting themselves into when they agreed to appear on 'Nationwide'. Sue Lawley was/is renowned for this interviewing style.
 
Makes you wonder who is looking at this forum, the interview itself was not sensational, someone will probably shout "COPYRIGHT". I can't believe old auntie beeb could have pulled the plug, why should the BBC care so much about this particular interview? Richard & Karen have done hours and hours of interviews, concerts, and documentaries for the BBC........and there still remains plenty of BBC clips on YouTube. This interview has rattled someone's cage, pity as this was one of the few interviews carried out at the BBC in front of a camera, usually they opted for radio interviews only.

There must be a way to put this back on the forum, I don't know how, but someone must.
 
Wow that was quick!! But I noticed it says...video removed by the user...that does not necessarily mean the BBC requested it taken down, does it? Wouldn't it say something about "copyright notice" it does not say that, the user took this down, maybe Stephen can ask the user why?

I agree with Chris Mills...although I'm not suprised...someone must have seen this and was upset with the content or BBC really does have a police guard on patrol. :laugh: I'm not sure if anyone is aware but this forum is easily linked to google search on thread titles posted here...for instance just for this clip thread, if you google, A&M carpenters bbc nationwide and search "past week" this thread appears on first page google search.

I'm not sure I agree that it should be placed back on the forum though if indeed that was the reason for copyright or BBC requested because then this forum could be liable if it's seen again...assuming that was the reason it was removed...just thinking outloud. :)
 
Actually, the video was given to and subsequently posted by someone who was asked *not* to post it publicly in the first place, due to potential copyright issues etc. Those wishes were not followed, and after learning this, the original lender has asked that the video be removed. Just an FYI... :)
 
Having previously only viewed the edited clip of this interview where Karen looks very angry at being confronted by Sue Lawley about anorexia, and being as a huge fan of Carpenters, I found this a really interesting interview. I watched it six times, and thought it fascinating. Karen was a complete enigma, once you got passed the girl from Downey CA., who loved needle point and Disney, there was a hidden troubled person in dire need of help.

I would like to thank the person who shared this clip with us.
 
I'm not sure if anyone is aware but this forum is easily linked to google search on thread titles posted here...for instance just for this clip thread, if you google, A&M carpenters bbc nationwide and search "past week" this thread appears on first page google search.

When I tried that it is still blocked. I didn't get to it until it was gone. I have seen the clip of the specific part where Sue Lawley asks Karen about anorexia and she quickly denied being 84 lbs. I cannot even imagine what it is like to be anorexic (fortunately), let alone be anorexic and in the public eye. Would like to have seen the whole interview. :cry:
 
Well...the one thing that stands out to me, other than what's been noted, is Karen's iron will and forcefulness. I remember RC saying once that "when Karen made up her mind about something, that was it." If I were Ms. Lawley I probably would've gotten the warning signs watching KC's body language and tone and really turned in another direction. I would love to her what KC had to say behind doors after this went down.
 
Is there any way of seeing this clip again? Or have i missed out on seeing it?
Mind you, i REALLY don't like it when people are grilled like that, it's a bit like listening to BBC Radio 4's morning TODAY programme, i sometimes squirm with embarrassment!!
 
I wish I didn't miss this interview either...

Sounds better the more comments I see (though not a good rapport judging from what I've read) and sorry that I didn't tune in at the right time, too...!


-- Dave
 
I missed it also. Was using iPhone and the video wasn't available for mobile... Kept forgetting to get on computer. :sad:
 
I watched it up through the blank screen/re-start and then abandoned it figuring I'd get back to it later, but it disappeared. I guess I saw the most pertinent stuff anyway.

Harry
 
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