35th Anniversary Liner Notes.... :)

Status
Not open for further replies.

Chris May

Resident ‘Carpenterologist’
Staff member
Moderator
I have had the opportunity to read through the liner notes from the box set. Very interesting. I was always unable to obtain a copy of the 30th Anniversary release, and don't know if the pictures of the master tape legends were included in that set, but I found that to be the most intriguing of all! A majority of what I read was not anything I hadn't already heard, either from Richard himself or from Randy's book. A few facts that I was unaware of were:

1) The 1971 Bacharach medley ("Carpenters") rhythm tracking was played by the musicians from the live show per Richards request and not studio musicians. This was due to the fact that they were all very familiar with it, and were playing it every night on the road. Richard said that "we all got it in one take, although due to the inconsistency of the tempos was 'sped up'". The album version was "just too fast".

2) As mentioned in an earlier thread, the "Christmas Portrait" album (remixed version) was due to the fact that the master and master-copy of the album from 1978 upon shipment to Japan was now defective, even though they were mixed onto an "improved series of tape".

3) "Your Wonderful Parade" and "All I Can Do" on the "Offering" album were actually the demos cut in Joe Osborn's garage studio, "All I Can Do" in its entirety and "YWP" the whole track, less the strings, etc which were replaced at A&M during the tracking of the album.

These were just a few, however as I mentioned, the most interesting thing is the tracking logs from some of the songs/albums. It is notable that as "Offering" was recorded 8-track (with the exception of the two songs listed above from Joe Osborn's studio which were cut on 4-track), the next four albums cut 16-track, and the remaining on 24-track. It is fairly consistent that the backing vocals were all submixed onto a total of (4) tracks on every master. As it was handwritten "BG ones, BG twos, BG threes, etc... Or simply listed "VC group #1, VC group #2, etc".

The notes on the "Superstar" master for instance, on one of the track spaces it is listed as "new oboe track", another "new harp", "tpts (trumpets)", "bones-horns" on track 16 space etc. Also a notation off to the side by the engineer "track 5 good if lead vocal to be doubled on choruses". I also noticed that on most of the masters with regards to the strings, the viola/cello were always submixed onto one track, and the violins separately on their own track (singular).

On "Won't Last A Day", the background vocals which are of course logged by track #'s, and "BG Ones/BG Two's", with notations (<) indicating the phrases in reference "When you're near..." and opening "Oohs" on both tracks, (meaning these are the background vocals for these particular phrases found on these tracks). Pretty interesting stuff.

I know that my cheesy notes here don't do justice to what is in the book, but just thought I would share a few things that stuck out to me. -Chris
 
Chris,

Amazing post! I love to read your insight into the studio goings-on... wish I could understand all of that but haven't had quite enough work in that area. Still very fascinating.

I really wish Richard would work on a book detailing all their recording sessions and give us all the juicy details on every recording and he could even clear up what outtakes truly exist and in what shape they are. The great thing about this would be that if it were written by Richard HIMSELF it would be that much better... first of all -- Richard is a GREAT writer. And he loves to tell all the little details about every little thing. He's spent the last 20 years telling us mostly the same stories. Now, with recent liner notes, he has become MUCH more candid and detailed -- I think he is getting the picture that we absolutely love this stuff.

There is definitely a place on the market for a book such as this. It would go way beyond simply the Carpenters fan base... it could be studied for its merits as a book about pop music history, the studio techniques Richard employed and everything else that went into the creation of the Carpenters sound.

Someday...

Randy
 
Randy, I couldn't agree with you more! To be quite honest, I was thinking about this the other day; I believe that Richard may very well decide to release such a book. The Beatles did, and Brian Wilson has become more open minded with the past release of release of the "Pet Sounds" sessions, Stack-O-Tracks, Good Vibrations box set, etc... (pointing out the fact that such greats are letting lose with the secret ingredients).

I think Richard's book would do quite well, considering not only the fact that he is considered the "king" of pop arrangers, but also the fact that he was capable of producing and creating recordings that were so well bookended and tied together like a perfectly wrapped package in ALL aspects of production, that industry gurus wouldn't be able to help but read it and study it. I would also be stoked to hear just an album full of outtakes. Oh well, maybe one day...Just a few of my thoughts; -Chris
 
I was thinking -- how can we get the message to Richard that we WANT a book like this? Then I remembered an email I sent to his manager almost a year ago. I never received a reply, but I hope it at least planted a seed or reminded David of something maybe they have already discussed... here is what I wrote then (this was written the week after the Top Of The World event at the Carpenter Center):

Do you know if Richard has ever considered compiling or
contributing to a book about the Carpenters' recording sessions? On Saturday
evening I overheard Richard telling some other fans about the 49 or so takes
to get a particular song in a strict tempo, working with click tracks, etc.
Some others asked about the little "squeak" in "Bless the Beasts" and
Richard informed them it was someone opening a door to the studio while the
Hammond organ was being tracked... some people don't even know there IS an
organ track on that song! I think it would be an awesome project to document
all these details, starting with their first OFFERING sessions at A&M
through Karen's last session in 1982. Detailed listings of studio personnel
could be provided for every song, in addition to studio locations, session
dates, etc. It would also give Richard the opportunity to comment on the
unreleased tracks since fans are always hounding him to release this or
that -- even though much of it is incomplete or was miscataloged!

The booklet included with the 1999 "mini-LP" box set from Japan included
images of master reels and track sheets revealing facts like "Saturday"
being recorded during the OFFERING sessions and breakdowns of instrumental
and vocal tracking. It would be especially interesting to know how many
takes were done, who contributed and in what ways, as well as see more
images of studio documents, contracts and even memorabilia to illustrate the
text. Beyond that, information on studio techniques, recording equipment,
comments from the session players, etc. would also be interesting.

It's obvious from the AS TIME GOES BY liner notes that Richard loves
details... and there are so many Carpenters fans and music lovers in general
who'd love more insight into the Carpenters recording process and the
sessions themselves -- I think this would be an incredible project for
Richard to consider over the next few years -- he is the only one who can
tell these stories. I would love to see something like "Carpenters: The
Complete Recording Sessions (1969-1982)" become reality... I hope you'll
share the idea with him, or perhaps it's already been discussed. Either way,
I think there would be a great demand for this sort of book. The best part
is that the focus of such a publication would be on the MUSIC and not the
personal issues Richard is undoubtedly tired of discussing.
 
Randy & All,

Great idea -Carpenters fans minds always thinking ahead for future great projects ....some of which Richard follows up :o

I did write to Richard probably five years after one of his CPAC concerts with same idea and with Beatles / Stones / Presley similar ...Complete Recordings of .....etc very much in vogue :)

Richard responded -not yet and no plans in short term -probably due to infamous Buried Treasure listing -still causing weekly demands from fans :!:

Would be great for Richard to write in detail on each track recorded , genre, leads,alternates, other info etc -however with Richard's Archive recordings plus Trio / Spectrum / Other Early Rarities -this would be HUGE TASK and Richard may prefer to avoid leaking some details in case fans with this info DEMAND even more sets / rarities releases :confused:

Still great idea -SOMEDAY -hopefully :wink:

Peter
 
I have a question about the new liner notes.

Sakura was nice enough to email me part of some of the liner notes.

My question is this part of the liner notes about Christmas Portrait that says:

"The listener will notice that this one album is not as
originally released, as the rest are. "Ave
Maria" was arranged from the start for chorus, as well as
orchestra. With so much music, not to mention people,
around the studio while the album was being made, the
choral parts were misplaced, only to be discovered after the
album was "in the can". The multi-track was retrieved, and
the chorus recorded, in 1984, during the "An Old
Fahioned Christmas" sessions. To all of us involved, it
was a great additon. The song was later remixed (and an
editing error in the lead vocal fixed) in 1990.

There was a EDITING ERROR in the lead vocal of Ave Maria? Can we hear this error of the German CD?

I also found it very interesting to read that Richard thought that Christmas Portrait should have been titled a Karen Carpenter album instead of a Carpenters Album, um??? Interesting.

Man, the more I think about it, the more I really want this new box set. :) Wonder how I would look in a McDonalds hat behind the counter? Would you like fries w/ that Big Mac? :tongue: ...needing extra cash, online... :wink:
 
I also found it very interesting to read that Richard thought that Christmas Portrait should have been titled a Karen Carpenter album instead of a Carpenters Album, um??? Interesting.
When I read that I thought how much Karen could have used hearing that from Richard at the time. Even if she wouldn't hear of it, which she probably wouldn't, the fact that the one person she revered the most paid her that high of a compliment would no doubt have made her feel good about herself. If only . . . :shake:
 
close2u said:
I really wish Richard would work on a book detailing all their recording sessions and give us all the juicy details on every recording and he could even clear up what outtakes truly exist and in what shape they are. The great thing about this would be that if it were written by Richard HIMSELF it would be that much better... first of all -- Richard is a GREAT writer. And he loves to tell all the little details about every little thing. He's spent the last 20 years telling us mostly the same stories. Now, with recent liner notes, he has become MUCH more candid and detailed -- I think he is getting the picture that we absolutely love this stuff.

Randy

Hi, Randy. I quite agree with you. But my feeling is that Richard may be a little hesitant to do so.Because in the linernote for the remixed Desperado from Interpretation, he mentions that the listener wouldn't care why he did or so and I feel that he's too much listener-friendly in that field and I'm hungry for details and even trivia.
One problem I can think of when he really puts out such writings is that you may take what is written the way you want it to be, not the way he originally means it.

I mean, when he calls some tune an outtake, everybody starts calling it an outtake and decides that it is not so great.

When he says they shouldn't have done songs like Postman, Sing or Beechwood, the fans decides they are no good.
But come on! he means it on conditions that If he had known that Karen would have gone so soon.

I feel Richard is a very modest person and seldom brags about the Carpenters. Against his high criteria, some songs seem below par and he calls them outtakes but that's a pro's comment.
You shouldn't let the words deceive you.

Still if there's a chance, I hope that project will come true.
 
First off, I don’t think when Richard refers to an outtake, he is always referring to a tune that he felt had a lesser meaning/value (i.e. Postman, etc…), as opposed to tunes that he felt Karen should have been singing had he known she was going to pass on at a young age (i.e. “I Get Along Without You Very Well”). I believe that a lot of the songs that everyone on this board keeps referring to that are in the vault really ARE outtakes, meaning songs that get tracked at the basic level, with no further consideration to finishing them, either because too many songs have been recorded for one project, or whatever the reason.

Most people don’t understand what really goes into making a recording as it is, not to mention the fact that the Carpenters were absolute “studio animals” as Richard puts it. I’m sure most of the stuff that is sitting around on 2” tape truly isn’t “finish-able” if you will (at least from a production/producer standpoint). Don’t get me wrong, as many of us have stated, we would LOVE to hear that stuff. But, as the creator so to speak (referring to Richard), I don’t think our ‘wanting’ or ‘needing’ to hear this stuff necessarily outweighs Richard’s reason as a producer for not releasing it. Just a few thoughts. :) -Chris
 
I know for a fact that Richard was dead serious when he made that comment about the songs he regretted recording.The fact is,those songs he mentioned are not good songs-period!Those types of songs aren't good enough for a singer of karen's(vocal)stature.Karen could've done much better.Someone made a comment on another post about Richard doing a concert of "70's love songs" with Bread and The Captain and Tennille.How pathetic!Obviously,even many die-hard fans relegate Karen and Richards music as dated 70's pop fodder.How about Richard doing a concert with Tony Bennett and Astrud Gilberto?That would be more in line with his artistic abilities!Personally,I agree with Richard-they should have been doing more songs of the caliber of "I Get Along Without You Very well"-And I think Richard's comment gives clear evidence about how he really feels-that Karen should have spent more time being a jazz singer,and alot less time being a pop singer!
 
Imagine if Karen were still alive today. They would have eventually done an album like Norahs Jones' big hit- quiet, elegant, with jazz nuances. Woulda been great!

I've always thought of the Tan album as their "quiet masterpiece" -
if you exclude "Saturday" and "Druscilla Penny"!

I must admit that although the songs Mr. J points to are very playful, they did, in my opinion, diminish Karen and Richard's image. At the very least, they reinforced an image of them some folks already had. That's too bad, as we real fans know them as one of the most talented and classiest acts of all time.

Mark
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top Bottom